Striking a China?

[Drum Pilot]

Gidday All,
I am looking at adding a china to my set up for bigger rock gigs and just wondering what the correct way to strike a china is?
I mean I know how to ride a cymbal and crash a cymbal, but as I have never owned a china previously, I am not quite sure how to hit it!!
Also chinas have quite a unique shape so where is the best part to hit it?
Thanks in advance for your replies, Cheers, Mark.:D

[PerryJustus]

Just crash it as you would a crash. Depending on what kind of China it is, you can also ride on it with the tip of the stick. Since you're playing rock, it makes more sense to mount it upside down, so the edges are down instead of up. (Actually, I don't think it ever makes sense to play it right-side up.)

[Mister_Acrolite]

Most people mount them upside down in a rock context. Experiment with it - it has different sounds when you crash it on the edge, and when you hit it right where the cymbal bends backwards.

In a jazz context, many drummers mount them right-side-up, and keep them low for easy riding. But not every china is ridable, in my experience - some wash out very quickly.

Have fun experimenting!


Mr. A.

[Seb]

Mounting a china flange-up makes hit sit more or less horizontal on the stand, which gives a better sustain, in my experience.
Mounting it flange-down, the edges and sticks meet in a less aggressive way. But the cymbal often wants to hang down on one side, with not much room to move. There's a kind of spring mount available to avoid cracks at the bell.
Upside down, you can also get a special "kang" attack from a china, hitting it on the flange.
Some chinas act more like crashes, some can be used for riding, too, without washing out - Swishes or Pangs.

[acidbran]

Get them, yellow for a heavier china, red for smaller , say 18" and under.
They mount kinda lousy..( hear me Roy?) but once on can save your cymbals from damage.:coffee:

[TPC]

i mount my 22" thin agop china bell up so i can really lay into the edge. also, last night i strung some of the heavier ball-bearing-light-chain on it and it sounds really good.

[JayCam]

I find my 15" sound way better when mounted bell up. It looks MUCH better mounted upside down and as I am a sucker for aesthetics I usually end up doing this. I dont have enough stands (only 2 and a 2 cymbal stacker) to mount my china at the moment so I guess I dont have to worry!

For larger chinas I would definately reccomend putting them bell up.

J.

[Drum Pilot]

Thanks for all the hints and tips guys, I am looking at both larger and mini chinas, but am probably leaning now towards the larger one now given it's abilitly to produce a variety of sounds, as opposed to the smaller ones, which would be more limited to accents only.
Cheers, DP.:appl:

[Tama_Paiste]

Thanks for all the hints and tips guys, I am looking at both larger and mini chinas, but am probably leaning now towards the larger one now given it's abilitly to produce a variety of sounds, as opposed to the smaller ones, which would be more limited to accents only.
Cheers, DP.:appl:

For less than a price of a ZIldjian or Paiste or Sabian china, you could get probably get a 12" wuhan china, a 27" wuhan china, and cymbal stands for em. Then you will have a china for accents and a china for F*&^ing loud crashes... best of both worlds. Or u cud go with a 12" and more reasonably sized 18-22"... but i still say having a gong sized china would be cool.

[Johan VDS]

adding a china to my set up for bigger rock gigs and just wondering what the correct way to strike a china is?

When mounted upside down China's are broken quite often because they are crashed on the ridge and not on the edge. The edge can move under the stick impact, the ridge cannot. Many drummers also overtighten their china's (and other cymbals).

So crash the edge and move the stick with a sweeping motion, holding the stick loosely.

If your adrenaline doesn't allow that kind of self-control, make sure to give a swirl to your cymbals every now and then (like in between songs), thus avoiding to hit the very same spot each time and preventing consequent metal-fatigue.

[ivmike]

For flange-down-but mounted-right-side-up chinas, check out the Paiste Novo, Paiste Rock and the UFIP Tiger.

http://www.paiste.com/products/cymbals/images/2002/2002_novo_china.jpg

http://www.paiste.com/products/cymbals/images/2002/2002_rock_china.jpg

[trashman]

For flange-down-but mounted-right-side-up chinas, check out the Paiste Novo, Paiste Rock and the UFIP Tiger.

UFIP's "Real China", from their Experience Series, is yet another nice example.

[Johan VDS]

Actually I just finished converting an 18" crash into such a reversed type of china.
It'll be be on my site soon....

[Qualitease]

never discount the wuhans...I have a 20" wuhan china which I drilled for 3 rivets...it sits in my regular setup with agop and bos.
Alan

[Skeet6]

I always played a Zidjian China Boy high 20" with my hardcore bands back through the 90's, never dmaged it at all in over 1000 shows all over NYC and the surrounding area.... (yellow one...) I did have to cut the threaded part off that boom stand to make it fit nice, (but it was an old NORTH brand stand) anyone remember those drums??????

[Will]

I play my 21" Wuhan bell up. I think that way of mounting it gives a better ride sound, plus it gives me access to the bell. The bell is there and it has a tone--why not use it? I agree about adding a rattler--it adds sustain and hiss on what is otherwise a very fast-speaking cymbal. I don't mind not being able to hit the flange--to me, that sound chokes the cymbal anyway, and it's not like I'm a double bass pinstripe using power tom player looking to kick my audience's asses. I want to be able to use all my cymbals as rides or crashes. And if I wanted to hit the flange, I could do it from underneath the cymbal.

By the way--I've had luck using hi hat felts instead of cymbal felts to build up height underneath the bell. They work nicely on splashes, too.

Also, the Wuhan I got wasn't one from Universal Percussion--on both that one and my World Percussion Wuhan China, I had to widen the holes to mount them on stands. Their holes were drilled for rope-hanging.

Last, Steveweissmusic.com seems like a decent place to get 27's. Musician's Friend doesn't carry them, and not many music stores do, either. I think Steve will help you pick a decent one.

Will

[Will]

I found a strange trick on my china today. Mount the cymbal bell side up, take the top felt off, and whack the top of the bell with the shank of the stick, starting near your thumb and backing up to the tip of the stick. This sounds really gross. Sorry. Anyway, I got a ton of different pitches from doing that, and the result of moving the stick back and forth was a flanging sort of effect.

Will

[Drum Pilot]

What great info, thanks guys!!:rockon:

[Agopsalott]

Is anyone other than me interested in a reverse bell china or pang? Perhaps in a 20 or 22. This would mean it would mount flange down, with all the different sounds of the ridge available, and also have access to a clear bell sound. Depending on the weight this could be a very different sounding ride as well.
I talked to Agop about producing a few prototypes by flipping the bells on their china pangs, and they said they would try it. I'm just wondering if there's a market.
Any thoughts?

[Morgan]

This may sound a little out of the ordinary, but when I play the one chinese cymbal I own, it's only in hardcore funk/fusion context... and I like to hit it upside down and almost vertical, so I can ride on it...

but the way I ride on it is to muffle it with the fingers of my riding hand while striking the upper part of the cymbal. I think I picked this up from watching Ian Froman play with Metalwood... I think it sounds badass... really clanky, trashy, different ride sound.

[bdbop]

Is anyone other than me interested in a reverse bell china or pang? Perhaps in a 20 or 22. This would mean it would mount flange down, with all the different sounds of the ridge available, and also have access to a clear bell sound. Depending on the weight this could be a very different sounding ride as well.
I talked to Agop about producing a few prototypes by flipping the bells on their china pangs, and they said they would try it. I'm just wondering if there's a market.
Any thoughts?ivmike posted some pictures of Paiste offerings similar to what you're describing, Sinc. Scroll up - it's in this very thread! They look very interesting.

[trashman]

Is anyone other than me interested in a reverse bell china or pang? Perhaps in a 20 or 22. This would mean it would mount flange down, with all the different sounds of the ridge available, and also have access to a clear bell sound. Depending on the weight this could be a very different sounding ride as well.
I talked to Agop about producing a few prototypes by flipping the bells on their china pangs, and they said they would try it. I'm just wondering if there's a market.
Any thoughts?

Here's a 20" UFIP Tiger China with a profile similar to what I think you're describing, Sinclair:

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y298/emmett9/UFIP-Tiger-China-Profile.jpg

You're right, it does provide a few more options than the standard bell-down/flange-down profile does.

If Agop tried producing their Traditional Pangs like this, I'd find picking one (or more) up irresistable.

[Agopsalott]

Thanks for the input guys...and the picture trashman. I did see the Pastie picture Mark.
In the never ending search to find different sounding rides I imagined a reverse bell china pang as a possible candidate.
I'm wondering... if they kept the weight in the bell area and then got thinner as it goes out to the flange. Ideally you'd have a decent bell, enough weight for a good stick sound and the thinner flange for the china sound, and some crazy wash when riding. Three cymbals in one. I'm i missing anything?
Any reason this couldn't work with a little tweaking?

[Johan VDS]

Is anyone other than me interested in a reverse bell china or pang? Perhaps in a 20 or 22. This would mean it would mount flange down, with all the different sounds of the ridge available

Here's my version of that concept. This one comes from a Paiste Dimensions 18" crash. It sounds like this (http://users.telenet.be/cymbzdrumz/1.%20COMPLETELY%20REHAMMERED%20CUSTOM%20CYMBALS/SPLASHES%20-%20CHINA'S%20-%20EFFECTCYMBALS/18'%20Inverted%20China%20(from%20Paiste%20Dimensio ns%20Crash).mp3).

The pic isn't too good but you can see that it's an inverted china model...


http://users.telenet.be/cymbzdrumz/1.%20COMPLETELY%20REHAMMERED%20CUSTOM%20CYMBALS/SPLASHES%20-%20CHINA'S%20-%20EFFECTCYMBALS/18'%20Inverted%20China%20(from%20Paiste%20Dimensio ns%20Crash).jpg

[GiantBeater]

i like Charlie Watt's china that he uses as a crash... i think its a ufip natural series (with white lettering) can anyone confirm this?? Anyone know what charlies ride is? VIntage ufip flat ride? thanks